The Heresy of the Christian Fellowship and Pope Vic Halls' teachings.

Spiritual or Earthy?? You be the judge.
Faith Hopegood
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Re: The Heresy of the Christian Fellowship and Pope Vic Halls' teachings.

Post by Faith Hopegood » Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:53 pm

Your post highlights a very important distinction between the poisonous Christian Fellowship teachings and historical Christian individuals in protestant history. Contrast the highly destructive inward looking teaching of BCF with the huge achievements of protestant individuals over the last 500 years.

Here are a few notable achievers who were hugely committed christians in their own personal lives whilst leading to some historic breakthroughs and achievements in science, health, engineering etc: Isaac Newton, Michael Faraday, Lewis Carrol, Louis Pasteur, James Joule, Joseph Lister, Lord Kelvin. Don't forget some of the famous Scottish ship and bridge builders who are responsible for most of the famous civil structures in the world.

These are people who heard the call of God upon their lives and used their God given talents to the highest levels for the betterment of mankind as a whole. If Vic had been the pastor to any of this people and taught them the destructive rubbish as you highlighted above Paul, we would still be living in thatched huts poking coal stoves in winter!

We have to remember, Vic hates people succeeding. Vic must be number one. This is why the teachings of the Christian Fellowship are so twisted and heretical.

Faith Hopegood
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Re: The Heresy of the Christian Fellowship and Pope Vic Halls' teachings.

Post by Faith Hopegood » Sat Dec 08, 2018 4:57 pm

Further to the above post, I would encourage all people, both in and out of the Christian Fellowship, to follow and nourish the gifts that God has naturally given you. Pray to God directly and ask Him, your Creator, to show you what you are to do with your God given gifts, where to work and what to study. God will not let you down. He will guide you by His Holy Spirit in both thought and action. Of course your journey will not be smooth and will have trials and tribulations as well as supreme blessings and heavenly support.

It is a biblical principle to strive for excellence in everything you do. Read Proverbs 22:29 "Do you see a man skilful in his work; He will stand before kings; he will not stand before obscure men."

Contrast the biblical instructions with the actions and words of Vic Hall and the Christian Fellowship. God wants you to be happy and satisfied with your life and work whereas Vic Hall and his rank minions would constantly tear you down, cause you to doubt your heavenly calling and put snares, traps, discouragemen, destruction and dispair to your life.

Look to your Heavenly Father for your future, not earthly false teachers.

robocop
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Re: The Heresy of the Christian Fellowship and Pope Vic Halls' teachings.

Post by robocop » Thu Dec 13, 2018 11:44 am

I have just come across this article on the Internet, which clearly shows how the Scriptures have been manipulated and re-arranged over the centuries.
Maybe we can add the heresies of BCF to the list - I'm sure mainstream Christianity would be just as shocked to see the heresies of Swampford...

https://www.npr.org/2018/12/09/67499507 ... -rebellion

Thanomere84
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Re: The Heresy of the Christian Fellowship and Pope Vic Halls' teachings.

Post by Thanomere84 » Fri Feb 15, 2019 2:29 am

Faith Hopegood wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:53 pm
We have to remember, Vic hates people succeeding. Vic must be number one. This is why the teachings of the Christian Fellowship are so twisted and heretical.
VERY true. He must be 'the fatherhood' in all things. He must be 'the head' in all things. He must have 'the fathering word', i.e. the final say and the last word, in all matters, questions, doubts, discussions, proposals and plans. And no one, ABSOLUTELY NO ONE, can try to take any direction that deviates even the slightest from where he's set the course. Should anyone even remotely attempt to do so - they will suffer a tempest of gang-style attacks, organised for the final goal of ripping that person's life, confidence, hopes, dreams, future and happiness to shreds.

Faith Hopegood
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The doctrine of Sinless Perfection

Post by Faith Hopegood » Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:42 pm

I stubbled across this doctrine and link in my readings last week and what a surprise I got when I found out the doctrinal theology of Sinless Perfection was introduced into the Australian church landscape back in the early 1930's.

The information I read from an author called Piggins in a book called
Stuart Piggin, Evangelical Christianity in Australia: Spirit, word and world, Melbourne: Oxford University Press, 1996.

I also found an interesting link here on the ungodly doctrine.
https://au.thegospelcoalition.org/artic ... ectionism/

All this got my little brain cells thinking "Ah!!! I have heard this somewhere else!".

I would draw our good readers attending to that wonderful work by Victor Hall called "Unto Perfection" published in 1987 and its really exciting 1990 sequel "Let us God On Unto Perfection".

Sadly, the demand is just not there for reprints of these theological masterpieces and they are long out of print.

There are those of us who are old enough to remember all the hullabaloo in the Fellowship when Vic Hall first published Unto Perfection in 1987. It was mandatory reading for all the congregation and it was heavily pushed at the bookstand/table which each fellowship used to run at the back of each church service. For years Vic was held in Pontif like awe by the plebs and every nearly every sermon and home group study at the Christian Fellowship was sourced from Vic's words of wisdom. We all sat around like 1960's hippies listening to their guru whilst experimenting with hallucinagenic drugs such was the trance Vic had everyone in. Every time someone spoke it was "Vic said this and Vic said that". There was not much about Jesus to be honest.

Anyway, my point is this. Vic Hall presented his heretical teachings in Unto Perfection as divine inspiration from God and a never before seen "correct" view of the scriptures. Vic was truly seen as a guru in the Christian Fellowship circles (along with sidekick minions and Co-authors, Murray Wylie and Doug Watt). Now we find out this type of teaching about Sinless Perfection is not new at all and was introduced into Australia by 6 families back in the 1930's including a family called Agnew (which some people will know is synonymous with the Exclusive Brethren although this is not confirmed at this point). Apparently even Charles Wesley dabbled in this doctrine for a while and then had to clarify and change his ways.

Vic Hall is just a plain out and out lier and deceiver. He packages up old discredited doctrines (which have been denounced by most churches as dangerous or plain heresy) and then proceeds to con the people in the Christian Fellowship that Vic received all this via "revelation".

The question is this: Does Vic Hall still hold to his doctrine as presented in Unto Perfection, or, has Vic Hall changed his doctrine? Either way, it proves the man is just a charlatan and con-man who brazenly manipulates and controls people. I truly hope that some people in the Christian Fellowship read this post and do some research and take my advice - run, get out of there, run far, run fast and don't go back. Find a church that preaches the true bible gospel and not the empire of some con-man, no matter how nice all the people who are in the Christian Fellowship are. All cults, particularly christian cults, are full of "really nice people.

Do some research yourselves into the subject and read about it.

robocop
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Re: The Heresy of the Christian Fellowship and Pope Vic Halls' teachings.

Post by robocop » Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:18 pm

Hi Faith, hope you receive this. I have not looked in on Streetcar for so long and just opened it to find your recent post there. Thanks for your input, as there are not many posting these days (Sad). I was the printer who spent months printing that damned book 'Unto Perfection' - in all the time I was doing it Vic never once looked in on me. I used to finish up some nights at 11pm and have to get a cab home. Alex Wylie was the only Elder who came near me to thank me for the effort I was putting in. He organised a small reimbursement for my efforts (something no one else did for me).
I recall trying to decode that gobblygook for years after, and still it didn't make any sense.
I hope this finds you well and not being brain-washed by all the hype around the 'virus'.
Thanks again for posting the article.
Robocop.

Faith Hopegood
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Re: The Heresy of the Christian Fellowship and Pope Vic Halls' teachings.

Post by Faith Hopegood » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:11 pm

Hello Robocop, wonderful to hear from you. Your post has found me well, healthy and happy.

Yes, I remember your travails with your printing work and all the effort you put in. And yes, Vic was a thankless sod, which is I think is a personality trait of narcissists and psychopaths. Vic had similar ruthless personality traits similar to the fallen leader of the Falkencrest Slave Stables. (birds of a feather flock together). They had an uncanny ability to identify people who would be useful to them, then proceed to use up all their resources, whether it be time, money or expertise. Once they had consumed you, they then discarded you/me without even a second thought or a blink of an eye or even a care for your welfare.

I too am disappointed that there are not more posts on Streetcar. I hope the Streetcar Administrators are actually looking at the applications of people who wishing to join Streetcar.

Faith Hopegood
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Fractured Fellowship - Trinity Presbyterian Church Camberwell

Post by Faith Hopegood » Thu Oct 07, 2021 9:03 pm

Further to my post above about Vic Hall plagiarising the heretical Doctrine of Sinless Perfection, I thought I would provide some details of how this has manifested and been dealt with in other churches other than The Christian Fellowship group of churches.

There is a historical connection of Brisbane Christian Fellowship to the Wavell Heights Presbyterian Church in Brisbane. In 1977 Presbyterian ministers, Alex Wylie and Ian Barlow, together with Presbyterian Session Clerk, Bill Barnes, left the Wavell Heights Presbyterian Church along with a large number of the congregation to go and fellowship with Brisbane Christian Fellowship at Enoggera(?). Consequently, the historical roots of the Brisbane cult have a Presbyterian foundation, with a bit of Pentacostalism thrown in.

To be fair to Wylie, Barlow, Barnes and the Wavell Heights congregation, the Presbyterian Church in Australia, up until the creation of the Uniting Church of Australia in 1977, had a dreadful track record of having very liberal teachings and theology which concerned a lot of bible believing Christians. This liberal teaching resulted in two famous Presbyterian heresy trials, Samuel Angus in the 1930's and Peter Cameron in the 1990's (these guys didn't believe parts of the bible and saw some things as optional). Anyway, fortuitously for the Presbyterian Church, all the liberal ministers, elders and congregation pretty much joined the UCA in 1977 thus clearing the decks of the PCA. This was the greater church climate that Wylie, Barlow and Barnes were living in, and the doctrine of Vic Hall and BCF must have been very alluring at this time. After 1977, the PCA forged a path as a definitely bible believing church with reformed beliefs and teachings.

David Holden has written an excellent summary of the dodgy teachings of BCF. You can find his book/article here:
http://www.defenceofthefaith.org/BCF2ed.htm (click on BCF History and scroll down to Churches Split for the Wavell Heights information).

Moving from Brisbane to Melbourne, we go to Trinity Presbyterian Church at Camberwell (and two other nearby Pressie churches). It is here that there is a group known as The Fellowship. Essentially this was a cult like sub-group of the three churches that privately met and exhibited all the same teachings and dangerous group behaviour and pressures that are exhibited in the Brisbane Christian Fellowship group of churches. The Trinity Fellowship group had been meeting for decades and predated Ray Jackson and Vic Hall's "revelation" of Sinless perfection.

In summary, The Fellowship at Trinity basically did all the same bad stuff that BCF and Vic Hall are known for. Putting pressure on people, practising the denounced pastoral methods Shepherding and Discipling of the Fort Lauderdale Five (these terms of Shepherding and Disciplining are specifically related to a group in the USA and are not the conventional biblical terms as we know them). The Fellowship also extensively practiced exclusivity and shunning of family members. (where have we heard this before!!). The Presbyterian Church of Victoria received a flood of complaints and held an investigation that resulted in quite a few of the leaders of The Fellowship being excommunicated from the Presbyterian Church and cutting out the cancerous tumour.
It has variously been described as:A perfectionist movement, an authoritarian movement, an unbalanced movement, and exclusive movement. (pg15,16)

You can have a good read about all the details of the Trinity Fellowship at these links and I would encourage you do so. Because knowledge of history is extremely important so we don't make these dreadful mistakes again in the future.

Here is a link to the report published by the Presbyterian Church of Victoria. It is called Fractured Fellowship and should be mandatory reading for anyone wanting to know about where the teachings of BCF will lead you.
https://www.apologeticsindex.org/pdf/Fellowship.pdf

Here is a link by Rev Rowland Ward (Minister of the Presbyterian Church of Eastern Australia) with a review of Morag Zwartz book.
https://rowlandward.net/review-fracture ... urch-cult/


And just so there is no ambiguity. I do believe that we Christians should be holy, we should turn away from sin and turn to the Lord and follow Him with all our heart and mind.

However, I strongly denounce the horrible way in which Vic Hall and his cronies teach faulty bible teachings, selectively shoehorning scripture for their means to exert fear and control over people. With Vic Hall and the Christian Fellowship group, there teachings is solely focused on control and they way they do it is with domination, intimidation and manipulation.

Hoping you are well and enjoying life.
Faith Hopegood.

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